"Courage" album - Official Topic

[marc-02]

 

And besides Coldplay's album it turns out are not actually the threat to Courage this week. As Coldplay are not expected to hit No. 1 in the US... Even in the UK, it's still not certain if they will debut at the top. Though currently they are in the lead, they are neck and neck with Robbie Williams Xmas album, both gunning for the top spot.

To be honest the new Coldplay album is dreadful. I still wonder how such a great band can put out such garbage.

[DionFanAlways]

The only problem for me is the lack of new songs on the tour live... Hopefuly that will change by the Euro leg...

 

Sent from my VTR-L09 using Tapatalk

But why wait for the Euro leg of the tour to change the set? (This was directed at her/team not you specifically:) ) This would make no sense to me at all and not to mention, really tick me off! Why deny half of your audience? I don’t get it. Call me jealous if this is really the plan!

[deccan]

Its not confirmed confirmed. Gatica replied to someone on Instagram and said that PMLALS would be released on Valentines Day..thats all we know. The rest is putting pieces together/rumors.

maybe another album courage2.0 is on the way, maybe PMLALS is included.

 

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[deccan]

maybe another album courage2.0 is on the way, maybe PMLALS is included.

 

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then the TC will put effect on gaining four no.1 albums in 4 decades. is the idea too crazy?

 

通过我的 VOG-AL10 上的 Tapatalk发言

 

 

[mebe]

then the TC will put effect on gaining four no.1 albums in 4 decades. is the idea too crazy?

 

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Maybe that's why they don't promote Courage that much now lol

 

Envoyé de mon SM-A520W en utilisant Tapatalk

 

 

[marc-02]

then the TC will put effect on gaining four no.1 albums in 4 decades. is the idea too crazy?

 

通过我的 VOG-AL10 上的 Tapatalk发言

 

If this happens she will be one of only two female artists to have a no. 1 album in each of the past 4 decades, the other one being barbra.

 

Barbra's rercord is harder to beat. She's had a no. 1 album for each of the past 6 decades. And if she gets another one in the next few years, it will be her seventh.

[Chantemoi]

then the TC will put effect on gaining four no.1 albums in 4 decades. is the idea too crazy?

 

 

Sadly, I think so. Her saving grace for this #1 was the tour bundle. That won’t be the case if she releases another album next year.

[stevo]

 

 

Sadly, I think so. Her saving grace for this #1 was the tour bundle. That won’t be the case if she releases another album next year.

 

I think with the right songs and a huge blitz of promo, major duet etc etc, she could do it. Usually quieter for releases too

[Taking Chances]

What a pathetic idiot. Celine played by the rules - he needs to deal with it.

 

Well, if we're being fair, those rules are incredibly stupid. Tour bundles is basically like cheating. We know that's what people do these days, but it doesn't make it right. We all want Celine to do well, but come on, he's not a pathetic idiot. Just an actual passionate artist who wants recognition for his work. It's foolish of him to tweet like that though.

 

Mine still "In Shipping Process" not sure when are they going to send, hopeful in the next couple of days

 

Wonder if Japan version has booklet or just folded poster

 

I'm pissed that it still hasn't arrived. I'm gonna write them an email later and tell them how unprofessional I think it is.

 

I believe the Japanese version has the poster, but I'm not sure. Thankfully, I know I'm getting that tomorrow.

Edited November 26, 2019 at 02:19 PM by Taking Chances

[scielle]

Well, week-to-date the album has fallen to #30 in the US, with current STEAs at 3.8k. (Per Nielsen SoundScan)

[Taking Chances]

I swear to God, in Say Yes... I'm hearing "When he turns and SPONSORS you..."

 

Hahaha I was like... Ok why is there sponsorship suddenly involved in love? Haha!

 

Lmao! This is so funny to me.

 

I basically had the same thought when I first heard it. Some of the words in the lyrics sounds like completely different things, lol.

Edited November 26, 2019 at 02:31 PM by Taking Chances

[Xpresso]

I was just watching youtube.. and a video of play me like a lovesong came by.. and there i saw I reaction that was already placed a couple of months ago -

 

CONFIRMED: Play Me Like A Love Song will be released as the OST of the upcoming James Bond movie 'No Time To Die'. Release date: February 14, 2020 Source: Humberto Gatica (the producer) So happy with this news!!! ❣️❣️❣️

 

 

- is this true?

Well the Bond movie was supposed to come out on Feb. 14 but it seems that has been changed to April 2020 so this might just be wishful thinking. But I'm still hoping!

[Xpresso]

 

 

Well, if we're being fair, those rules are incredibly stupid. Tour bundles is basically like cheating. We know that's what people do these days, but it doesn't make it right. We all want Celine to do well, but come on, he's not a pathetic idiot. Just an actual passionate artist who wants recognition for his work. It's foolish of him to tweet like that though.

 

 

Well people don't get an album just for buying tickets. They actually have to redeem it so it's not a 100% return. It's more around 30% it seems.

And why should this be viewed as cheating while streaming is not? You probably know that a lot of that streaming is not completely honest. I'm sure some of those big streaming artists actually hire "streamers!" Well maybe not but you get my point.

That guy was complaining he sold more albums than Celine but in fact most of his numbers came from streaming, not actual sales.

As I said before, young artists benefit from streaming and veteran acts benefit from ticket bundles. By the way, it's the first time Celine uses it!

Edited November 26, 2019 at 03:04 PM by Xpresso

[Katie]

Has the album been released today in Japan?

[Holborn]

Here's the actual tweet. I knew he wouldn't have the balls to keep it.

 

 

 

Anyway, at least she's holding pretty good on iTunes ww and eu albums. I didnt expect these positions after Friday but somehow and with 0 promo shes managing it. USA is where the more obvious problem is.

 

https://kworb.net/aww/

 

https://kworb.net/eua/

 

 

Im still very happy with all that. We wanted a great album and a no.1 and we got both. We wanted at least one video clip and we got 2 mv's plus 1 lyrics video and 1 live performance.

 

I clearly remember that most of us here were certain that nothing from the above would happen. But the thing is that no matter what happens, we will always want more. I want promo, i want her to remain on top for a month, i want her to get millions of streams and views..i also want to win 5 mil. and just follow her around, but it is what it is. Let's just enjoy more and stress less. And let's get excited for the new set list!

[Katie]

Number 11 in Spain

 

https://www.elportaldemusica.es/lists/top-100-albums/2019/47?platform=hootsuite

[Nmj]

This brings joy...

 

 

Imagine if she actually promoted this album.

 

[SantiagoColorado]

Well, if we're being fair, those rules are incredibly stupid. Tour bundles is basically like cheating. We know that's what people do these days, but it doesn't make it right. We all want Celine to do well,

 

Maybe that's why tickets were so expensive they were charging us the concert + the album... I'm from México, so I'm not receiving a copy of the album though

Edited November 26, 2019 at 03:46 PM by SantiagoColorado

[yoyoma]

Well, week-to-date the album has fallen to #30 in the US, with current STEAs at 3.8k. (Per Nielsen SoundScan)

I think we have to be prepared that celine will be out of 200 this week. And also will be crowned as the biggest drop of all time or for female artist. Madonna slipped from 1 to 77 last summer

[idroveallnight]

 

Something like this, couldn't take a full screenshot

 

Well then there's something to be said for her being number one due mostly to physical album sales which are so rare today--even if it's because of album/tour bundles, people still had to consent to paying a little extra to buy the album. I don't see any issue with her capitalizing on her tour power, especially since her music isn't being played on the radio, she gets little support from her record label, and she gets snubbed at awards ceremonies despite putting out quality albums, collaborations, etc. I nearly gasped when I saw Spotify promoting her album in Times Square because she's been counted out for so many years--for reasons that don't seem apparent to me. When you go through the comments on her YouTube vids, it's all young people saying her music is better than the garbage being produced today. It's not like Celine had an easy entry into the industry at the beginning of her career like this guy and so many new artists today have...she and Rene worked relentlessly to make it. This era of musicians have so many platforms to make it from the Voice to YouTube, Idol, Spotify, Instagram, etc. It's a much bigger pool of competition but Celine has still managed to stay in the game despite it. It's like she would say in Vegas, "you didn't just give me a hit, you gave me a career."

 

He is using the streaming metric only and it looks like Billboard uses a formula where streaming is just one part of it. There's something to be said when people fork over their hard-earned cash for your music...and don't say it's an age thing because so many of us who were young when Celine put out her mega albums would save every dime and nickel to go out and buy those albums. Given that it's been 17 years, I think it's about time for her.

[smw]

Soak it in y’all

 

https://www.billboard.com/charts/billboard-200

[mikez]

I hate it that there's nothing on Céline on BBs main page

[marc-02]

 

 

Maybe that's why tickets were so expensive they were charging us the concert + the album... I'm from México, so I'm not receiving a copy of the album though

 

Yes that's the reasoning behind ticket bundle. It's not actually "cheating" as some here claim it is.

 

Think of it this way: a ticket, say, costs 150 dollars. But if they're doing ticket bundle they will advertise the price to the public as 165 dollars ($15 dollars for the album for example). So in reality, you paid for the album, you actually bought the album. The redemption portion now comes into play as a sort of you "acknowledging" that you got charged for the album too, so they send you the album.

 

If you didn't redeem, you just kind of paid for the album even if you didnt want to. But again thats where the redemption mechanism comes in. Neilsen Soundscan only counts redeemed album because of the "acknowledgement" part wherein u agreed that you got charged for the album as well. So there is no cheating there, the album was ACTUALLY SOLD to you, and only those redeemed will reflect in the charts. So on the "selling" part you probably got "cheated" if you didnt redeem, but as to the chart results, it still is an HONEST REFLECTION of the actual sales due to the redemption mechanism.

 

On the other hand, streaming is actually the more unreliable measure of "sales"... Because you just pay a subscription fee every month and listen to whatever yoy like, so your actual payment was not actually intended for a particular album or song artist, just a blanket payment for the usage/service. There's a reason why Neilsen Soundscan required x number of streams for it to be equivalent to an album sale because othereise streaming will be an unreliable measure of "sales."

Edited November 26, 2019 at 05:18 PM by marc-02

[joaofilho]

Celine has a number 1 in the United States this is very good, but I'm worried because there is no promotion of the album, just saw some sites talking about this feat. If their strategy was to keep Celine in the media because of the chart position it seems to have failed, no one is talking about it.

Still these days off I did not understand all this silence, I hope it changes.

[LukeD]

Well, if we're being fair, those rules are incredibly stupid. Tour bundles is basically like cheating. We know that's what people do these days, but it doesn't make it right. We all want Celine to do well, but come on, he's not a pathetic idiot. Just an actual passionate artist who wants recognition for his work. It's foolish of him to tweet like that though.

These are official Billboard rules whether we like them or not. Besides, nobody prevented him from going for tour bundles himself. And at the end of the day veteran artists have to rely on something to boost their album sales, since radios do not support them. Ageism is unfair. And this guy being in the music industry should have acknowledged that. It is a problem he is going to have to deal with in the future. But he is too short-sighted to see this now. So I find him both pathetic and unfair. Edited November 26, 2019 at 05:54 PM by LukeD

[AdrienneM]

Am I the only one that is a bit disappointed with 55k copies sold? I am thrilled at no.1 but somehow I thought the number would be higher because of the tour bundle.

 

Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk

 

Bundles dont count in Canada

[LukeD]

Sadly, I think so. Her saving grace for this #1 was the tour bundle. That won't be the case if she releases another album next year.

She can aim at releasing an album at a time in the year when competition is low. With some media exposure she can achieve #1 easily.

Number 11 in Spain

 

https://www.elportal...tform=hootsuite

This pretty bad. But she has been ignoring Spain so she had that coming.

I think we have to be prepared that celine will be out of 200 this week. And also will be crowned as the biggest drop of all time or for female artist. Madonna slipped from 1 to 77 last summer

My stomach hurt reading this. Edited November 26, 2019 at 05:57 PM by LukeD

[felicia]

Javascript is not enabled OR refresh the page to view

Click here to view the Tweet

 

 

https://www.billboard.com/articles/business/chart-beat/8544817/new-rules-merchandise-album-bundles

[mikez]

Oh is that because of this recent drama involving Céline?

[Holborn]

Oh is that because of this recent drama involving Céline?

 

Ofc not..

 

The tour bundles will remain the same, "The new policies do not affect albums that are part of a concert ticket/album sale redemption offer bundle, where the price of an album is part of the cost of a ticket and the album's inclusion is promoted to the customer at the beginning of their purchase experience. Then, after purchasing the ticket, the customer will receive an offer to redeem the album and have it mailed to them or to download it. Only the albums that are redeemed count toward Billboard's charts, indicating a desire by a consumer to receive the album."

 

However what's going on with the merch bundles is hillarious. Here's an interesting article that simply shows that what Celine has done is nothing extreme nor as fake as selling cd's with t-shirts or even pizza!

 

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/09/business/media/billboard-charts-bundles.html

 

Press x to stop loading the page or read from the spoiler. It's pretty long.

 

 

For decades, the phrase “No. 1 with a bullet” has referred to a song or album that zooms to the top of the Billboard charts. Given current music industry practices, “No. 1 with a T-shirt” may be more accurate.

 

Lately, many artists — and their record companies — have been trying to game the system of ranking musical hits by including free downloads of new albums with sales of concert tickets, clothing and other merchandise. It’s a widespread practice, and the result is some confusion about what, exactly, the weekly charts are measuring.

 

Now some of the very people who have taken advantage of this strategy are complaining about it, and Billboard is under pressure to change the rules governing its charts.

 

The use of so-called album bundles — tacking a download or CD to another purchase — is an age-old sales gimmick in the music industry, but now it’s everywhere. Of the 39 titles that went to No. 1 last year, at least 18 were sold as part of ticket or merchandise deals. One of the most prolific bundlers has been the Houston rapper Travis Scott, who last year claimed the top spot by selling key chains, hats and access to concert tickets.

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The next big bundler may be Taylor Swift. While her new album has no announced release date, her website is already accepting advance orders for it as part of deals for a hoodie ($65), a T-shirt ($40) and a smartphone stand (a bargain at $20), in hopes of its hitting No. 1 once it comes out.

 

At the same time, behind-the-scenes disputes have broken out between artists and Billboard’s chart referees when the trade publication deems particular deals out of bounds, potentially costing musicians their shot at the top slot.

 

Last month, there were two such disagreements: first when a Christian rock group, Hillsong United, lost out for No. 1 to Pink after some of its ticket deals were disqualified, and then in a bitterly contested race between DJ Khaled, a social-media star in the orbit of Jay-Z and Beyoncé, and the eclectic rapper Tyler, the Creator. Bubbling under the weekly chart competition is the question of whether the top positions are being determined by the popularity of a new album or the swag sold with it.

 

Billboard, whose charts are widely accepted as the last word in measuring the popularity of songs and albums, acknowledges the problem. It plans to announce this year that it will tighten the rules on merchandise bundling, said Deanna Brown, the president of the Billboard-Hollywood Reporter Media Group, a division of Valence Media.

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Artists and people in the music industry, Ms. Brown added, “tell us week after week, month after month, that they want us to occasionally throw a flag on the field when necessary.”

 

The rise of album bundles may be a response to the explosive growth of streaming and the rapid decline of album sales. From 2015 to 2018, revenue from album downloads plunged by about 53 percent in the United States and CD sales fell by 52 percent, according to the Recording Industry Association of America. Over the same period, streaming revenue more than tripled.

 

But the formulas that Billboard and Nielsen, its data partner, have adopted to reconcile the many ways that people consume music today have given artists and their marketers an incentive to push downloads and CDs, despite most fans’ preference for streaming. When it comes to the charts, each album a fan acquires — by itself or when tacked on to the purchase of a ticket or T-shirt — is worth about 1,400 times as much as any individual stream.

 

That has made bundling more appealing than ever to artists — even superstars like Ms. Swift, who could once reliably count on millions of CD sales. Not that she is new to bundling. In 2012, she had a deal with Papa John’s Pizza to sell her album “Red” with a large one-topping pie for $22.

 

One result is that the top chart position tends to go back and forth between artists with huge streaming numbers — like Drake or Post Malone — and those offering bundles.

 

The trend has led to some puzzling outcomes. In 2018, a ticket deal helped a year-old Bon Jovi album return to the top spot. And four months ago, the Backstreet Boys, a group that had not stood on the chart’s summit since 2000, opened at No. 1 with its fifth album since then, “DNA,” thanks again to a bundle for tickets to its summer tour. (The next week, “DNA” plunged to No. 24.)

 

Two weeks ago, the chart was held up by several days while Billboard studied the sales data of two new albums: Tyler, the Creator’s “Igor” and DJ Khaled’s “Father of Asahd.” Each had gotten an almost equal number of streams, so the contest for No. 1 largely came down to the validity of their bundles. Tyler offered clothing and even campaign-style lawn signs (“Vote Igor!”), while DJ Khaled’s album was included with sales of energy drinks through an e-commerce site, Shop.com.

 

After scrutinizing the two campaigns, Billboard gave the victory to Tyler. The magazine disqualified most of DJ Khaled’s bundled purchases, suspecting that some of the marketing by Shop.com and its corporate parent, Market America, had crossed a line by encouraging unauthorized bulk sales. One blog post from the company, for example, told its members to buy 12 packages to “push DJ Khaled and Market America to No. 1!”

 

Ms. Brown, the Billboard president, defended the decision. “In this particular instance,” she said, “we saw an organization encouraging purchases among their members by promising them material and organizational benefits.”

 

Both Market America and Roc Nation, DJ Khaled’s management company, said the decision had blindsided them. Desiree Perez, Roc Nation’s chief operating officer, also criticized the very practice of bundling, and Billboard’s countenancing of it, as a kind of weekly arms race that should be banned.

 

“We dispute their decision on behalf of DJ Khaled and, frankly, every artist who is forced to navigate bundling an album download with an inexpensive item that still effectively represents their brand,” Ms. Perez said in a statement. “It’s confusing and demeaning to the art.”

 

She added: “We’re obviously not fans of bundling, nor should anyone who cares about artists making music. But our hands are being forced by Billboard’s desperate, last-ditch effort to keep streaming from eliminating what’s left of music downloads.”

 

Market America, a so-called multilevel marketing company, has been criticized for its sales methods, such as requiring members to meet sales quotas. In a lawsuit filed two years ago, disgruntled former affiliates called the company a “pyramid scheme.” In an interview, Marc Ashley, the company’s president, denied that its members had sales quotas and dismissed the legal action as a “troll suit.”

 

Epic, DJ Khaled’s label, declined to comment.

 

To some extent, managing the charts has always been a cat-and-mouse game. In 2004, Prince gave copies of his album “Musicology” to fans who bought tickets to his tour. As a result, Prince earned his first Top 5 position in a decade and Billboard created a new rule, a version of which exists today: For a ticket bundle to count on the charts, the consumer must take a step to receive the music, like redeeming a coupon code. (No such rule exists for merchandise deals, however.)

 

“This is savvy gamesmanship,” said George Howard, a former record executive who is an associate professor of music business and management at the Berklee College of Music in Boston. “What’s new is that the industry is finding new ways to game a system that has always been gamed.”

 

Billboard has said it is still deciding how to revise its bundling rules, and has held a series of industry meetings in recent months on the matter. Many of those have involved major-label record executives, who tend to favor bundles as an essential marketing technique as well as a chart strategy.

 

Until those changes are made, the charts are likely to continue to be affected by bundling deals, like the merchandise offered by Ms. Swift and a ticketing deal for Madonna’s latest tour.

 

For those artists, a Billboard No. 1 album is a vital trophy. Despite the wide availability of streaming data from sources like YouTube and Spotify, the magazine’s charts remain the most recognized sign of popular success, both inside the industry and among fans.

 

Yet even that is changing, as new artists look for new strategies to engage with their fans and new indicators of success, said Brian Popowitz, the general manager of Black Box, a music marketing agency in Los Angeles.

 

“This is a first-class problem that affects the top-tier, 1 percent of artists,” Mr. Popowitz said. “I see a lot more artists saying, ‘I really want to do Instagram,’ versus saying, ‘I want a No. 1 Billboard album.’”

 

Edited November 26, 2019 at 06:35 PM by Holborn