Sans attendre on the charts worldwide

[garçon]

If you're talking worldwide, then you're being obscene.

 

MDNA has sold over 1.5m copies worldwide.

 

Well, that was a bit premature for me to say indeed, if that's what you meant by that anyway

Although, probably, SA has a great chance to outsell the MDNA album.

[wjd]

Well, that was a bit premature for me to say indeed, if that's what you meant by that anyway

Although, probably, SA has a great chance to outsell the MDNA album.

 

I think that its fantastic that Celine's label have such confidence in her to ship such massive amounts of albums - 240,000 copies in Canada [when actual sales so far are barely 65-70% of shipments], France [where actual sales are less than 50% of shipments] - but trust me when I say this - THIS WILL NOT OUTSELL MDNA.

 

[GoldenLeaf]

I think that its fantastic that Celine's label have such confidence in her to ship such massive amounts of albums - 240,000 copies in Canada [when actual sales so far are barely 65-70% of shipments], France [where actual sales are less than 50% of shipments] - but trust me when I say this - THIS WILL NOT OUTSELL MDNA.

 

But Celine's upcoming english album will outsell MDNA for sure.

 

Comparing the sales of a French album with the sales of an English album that was released worldwide is pointeless anyway. It's like comparing apples with oranges.

 

As for ''Sans Attendre'' it will eventually sell over 400.000 copies in France alone. No doubt about that.

Edited December 10, 2012 at 08:57 PM by Calypso

[mike_z]

They usually ship 50% of actual sales since they need to replace the unit that has been sold! Imagine. If you have 20 cds in a store, and you sell the whole set, you run out of them! In the long term, usually everything is sold. Like "D'elles" which went out of stock almost everywhere.

 

Exceptions: for instance, if an album flops, like Mariah's "Glitter" or MJ's "Invincible", and the Record Company shipped a big amount, you will probably find it at very low prices. $1.99 But that has never happened with Celine's albums, so I'm pretty sure that if Sony shipped those many albums, they're pretty sure they will be sold.

[Kyle_Jared]

I think it's pretty confident to say that Celine will in the end sell what's been shipped for Sans Attendre. She's already at a quarter of a million in france for sales in a month, and 150K for Canada, which are freaking huge numbers.....the next three weeks of Sales will be interesting.

 

As for her new English album, I think because it's been so long (5 and half years by the time it's released) that there will be some hunger for it from her fans. Promotion will be key for that release and if they play their cards right, I'm sure she'll open strong in the U.S (I wouldnt want to see anything less than an opening number of 150K in the U.S. Alone). MDNA tanked. It opened well because of copies that were purchased with ticket sale to her concert, other than that, nothing to write home about.

[garçon]

I think that its fantastic that Celine's label have such confidence in her to ship such massive amounts of albums - 240,000 copies in Canada [when actual sales so far are barely 65-70% of shipments], France [where actual sales are less than 50% of shipments] - but trust me when I say this - THIS WILL NOT OUTSELL MDNA.

 

 

Well, Madonna sold around 500.000 of MDNA in the US, a number that's comparable to the half a million of SA in France

Soon SA will reach the one million mark of world sales (whether shipments or not). Then, the 1.5 million -the MDNA number of sales- comes in sight..

 

But Celine's upcoming english album will outsell MDNA for sure.

 

Comparing the sales of a French album with the sales of an English album that was released worldwide is pointeless anyway. It's like comparing apples with oranges.

 

As for ''Sans Attendre'' it will eventually sell over 400.000 copies in France alone. No doubt about that.

 

I don't agree, considering the amount of sales of SA, and the poor commercial succes of MDNA the comparison becomes more and more plausible.

 

And eventually cd's in stock will be sold for sure.. so, the number of shipments equals no worthless amount whatsoever

[wjd]

They usually ship 50% of actual sales since they need to replace the unit that has been sold! Imagine. If you have 20 cds in a store, and you sell the whole set, you run out of them! In the long term, usually everything is sold. Like "D'elles" which went out of stock almost everywhere.

 

Exceptions: for instance, if an album flops, like Mariah's "Glitter" or MJ's "Invincible", and the Record Company shipped a big amount, you will probably find it at very low prices. $1.99 But that has never happened with Celine's albums, so I'm pretty sure that if Sony shipped those many albums, they're pretty sure they will be sold.

 

Not true anymore - they used to ship back in the 90's 3 copies for every 1 copy that an album was predicted to sell in its opening week [i'm using the US model here, the rest of the world basically followed suit though]...this is obviously an average, there were exceptions. So if an album was predicted to break 350,000 sales in its opening week, the label would advance ship about 1.1m copies of it.

 

Nowadays, labels are much more constricted by money and by a shrinking industry - so albums are typically shipped according to double their opening week prediction or less.

 

Added to which - not everything does sell through...retailers have very limited space, and most will make use of the guarantee they have with labels and will send back anything that doesn't sell these days within the agreed limit.

 

Calypso - why are you so sure that Water and A Flame will outsell MDNA? I'm curious - is it based on Celine's declining Vegas success, or the fact that her last studio album which was released in quarter 4 failed to outsell Madonna's last studio album which was released 6 months later in a far more challenging market?

 

And finally, garcon - poor commercial performance of MDNA? Its one of the top 5 best-selling albums of the year so far, you need to rethink your definition of "poor commercial success".

 

With regards to Sans attendre - this is the bottom line...its been shipped very well in France, and that is all that matters at this stage, the fact that she's got her fifth diamond album in France under her belt. But don't work under the assumption that she'll sell all those CD's that have been shipped.

[dj4celine]

Wayne, that was a very balanced post regarding the sales. Nothing less I'd expect from you.

 

Keep on posting more, sweetie!

[wjd]

Wayne, that was a very balanced post regarding the sales. Nothing less I'd expect from you.

 

Keep on posting more, sweetie!

 

Why thank you darling!

[manu23]

Not true anymore - they used to ship back in the 90's 3 copies for every 1 copy that an album was predicted to sell in its opening week [i'm using the US model here, the rest of the world basically followed suit though]...this is obviously an average, there were exceptions. So if an album was predicted to break 350,000 sales in its opening week, the label would advance ship about 1.1m copies of it.

 

Nowadays, labels are much more constricted by money and by a shrinking industry - so albums are typically shipped according to double their opening week prediction or less.

 

Added to which - not everything does sell through...retailers have very limited space, and most will make use of the guarantee they have with labels and will send back anything that doesn't sell these days within the agreed limit.

 

Calypso - why are you so sure that Water and A Flame will outsell MDNA? I'm curious - is it based on Celine's declining Vegas success, or the fact that her last studio album which was released in quarter 4 failed to outsell Madonna's last studio album which was released 6 months later in a far more challenging market?

 

And finally, garcon - poor commercial performance of MDNA? Its one of the top 5 best-selling albums of the year so far, you need to rethink your definition of "poor commercial success".

 

With regards to Sans attendre - this is the bottom line...its been shipped very well in France, and that is all that matters at this stage, the fact that she's got her fifth diamond album in France under her belt. But don't work under the assumption that she'll sell all those CD's that have been shipped.

 

MDNA is not even the 15th best selling album of this year.. If you take out almost 300K given away with the tour tickets it would be even worst. This album is a total flop for Madonna standars but there is no way an album like Sans Attendre, being sold mainly in 4 or 5 markets could outsell MDNA, but in comparison I think it's perfoming much better.

 

It's true her previous album sold like 100K more than Taking Chances with a #1 hit with Justin Timberlake, but if Celine's promo for Water and a Flame is good she could easily outsell MDNA, lets wait and see

[LukeD]

 

Calypso - why are you so sure that Water and A Flame will outsell MDNA? I'm curious - is it based on Celine's declining Vegas success, or the fact that her last studio album which was released in quarter 4 failed to outsell Madonna's last studio album which was released 6 months later in a far more challenging market?

 

 

Going from 100% sold out shows to 96% can't be labeled as a decline. Οn other hand going from 1st week sales of 359k to 2nd week sales of 48k IS a major decline.

 

The Certifications of MDNA don't even reach 1.5m worldwide and this was Madonna's comeback album, the woman struggled to reach Gold in the most markets.

 

As for Madonna releasing in a more challenging market, I have to disagree again. Celine had big competition back in 2007 and she was still committed to Vegas.

[GoldenLeaf]

Calypso - why are you so sure that Water and A Flame will outsell MDNA? I'm curious - is it based on Celine's declining Vegas success, or the fact that her last studio album which was released in quarter 4 failed to outsell Madonna's last studio album which was released 6 months later in a far more challenging market?

I've made my own predictions for this album and judging by the current sucess of SA (500.000 copies worldwide in just 4 weeks even though this is a French album that wasn't even released worldwide), it wouldn't suprise me that W&AF would sell 2 millions copies.

[wjd]

Going from 100% sold out shows to 96% can't be labeled as a decline. Οn other hand going from 1st week sales of 359k to 2nd week sales of 48k IS a major decline.

 

The Certifications of MDNA don't even reach 1.5m worldwide and this was Madonna's comeback album, the woman struggled to reach Gold in the most markets.

 

As for Madonna releasing in a more challenging market, I have to disagree again. Celine had big competition back in 2007 and she was still committed to Vegas.

 

I don't really care if you disagree or not - facts are facts. Celine released her album in quarter 4 where record sales for some albums can practically be doubled. Madonna released album in April of the following year - notoriously the toughest time of the year, if you want big sales [in an industry that was about 18% on the decline, year on year].

 

And as for Madonna - the fact is, only three albums have sold more copies than hers this year. I don't really give a crap about personal standards, the whole industry is on the decline, nobody is immune. She has - 30 years into her career - never really put a foot wrong. I cannot stand her, or her bloody music - but MDNA is not a flop. And I highly doubt that Water and a Flame will match it, if the rumoured early year release is true.

 

Vegas success - to go from 100% to 96% isn't bad on paper, no. But its still a decline.

[wjd]

I've made my own predictions for this album and judging by the current sucess of SA (500.000 copies worldwide in just 4 weeks even though this is a French album that wasn't even released worldwide), it wouldn't suprise me that W&AF would sell 2 millions copies.

 

France - 240,000 [diamond - 500k]

Canada - 170,000 [3x platinum - 240k]

 

= 410,000 out of 480,000-odd sales have come from two countries. Again, there's nobody more happy than me at SA's sales, but fact is - two markets are making the success of the album seem more impressive than it is.

[Javito]

I never got this sales fight you create between Celine and Madonna... who cares who outsells who? I just care about what kind of songs Céline's album will include, and that's my only concern. If she outsells Madonna but the album is a huge crap full of Vegas covers mainly, she can sell 5 million copies but I as a fan will be disappointed.

 

However, if she delivers an album full of brand new songs, or even an album with a completely new sound like dance, but only 1,000 fans buy this, I will be in heaven because I will be surprised by her again.

 

I don't give a damn about her album sales, I just want new songs...

[LuisMa]

Comparing Celine and Madonna is a very dangerous topic. One of my best friends is a huge Madonna fan, but we'd rather not deal with comparing issues, because it can lead to a never ending and never winning discussion.

 

All I say is, I'm happy for both artists and that both do well.

[wjd]

I never got this sales fight you create between Celine and Madonna... who cares who outsells who? I just care about what kind of songs Céline's album will include, and that's my only concern. If she outsells Madonna but the album is a huge crap full of Vegas covers mainly, she can sell 5 million copies but I as a fan will be disappointed.

 

However, if she delivers an album full of brand new songs, or even an album with a completely new sound like dance, but only 1,000 fans buy this, I will be in heaven because I will be surprised by her again.

 

I don't give a damn about her album sales, I just want new songs...

 

Good, you're a good fan. I like that.

 

But I personally want her to be successful, I don't want her to be perceived as a relic - she was scorned for the better part of a decade for not being able to score a hit single in Anglophone markets [the fact she can't score a hit single anymore in English markets doesn't bother me - the scorn did], and I would constantly have to draw upon her previous hits on other websites, in order to instigate some discussion about Celine. But since 2007, people seem to be a lot more into her - casual people.

 

And I want that to blow up in the next era - and she will only do that by selling more albums.

[garçon]

I think that its fantastic that Celine's label have such confidence in her to ship such massive amounts of albums - 240,000 copies in Canada [when actual sales so far are barely 65-70% of shipments], France [where actual sales are less than 50% of shipments] - but trust me when I say this - THIS WILL NOT OUTSELL MDNA.

 

 

 

Well, Madonna sold around 500.000 of MDNA in the US, a number that's comparable to the half a million of SA in France

Soon SA will reach the one million mark of world sales (whether shipments or not). Then, the 1.5 million -the MDNA number of sales- comes in sight..

Edited December 10, 2012 at 11:30 PM by garçon

[garçon]

Besides, I raised the question to put the SA sales into some context.. In a way, Madonna, is the/a benchmark, as that other best-selling female artist in music history

[LukeD]

I don't really care if you disagree or not - facts are facts. Celine released her album in quarter 4 where record sales for some albums can practically be doubled. Madonna released album in April of the following year - notoriously the toughest time of the year, if you want big sales [in an industry that was about 18% on the decline, year on year].

 

And as for Madonna - the fact is, only three albums have sold more copies than hers this year. I don't really give a crap about personal standards, the whole industry is on the decline, nobody is immune. She has - 30 years into her career - never really put a foot wrong. I cannot stand her, or her bloody music - but MDNA is not a flop. And I highly doubt that Water and a Flame will match it, if the rumoured early year release is true.

 

Vegas success - to go from 100% to 96% isn't bad on paper, no. But its still a decline.

 

It is cool that you don't care about my opinion. Not nice, but cool. However, could you please really read what I'm saying before you post an answer?

 

I never said MDNA was a Flop, my comment was about the Fact that Madonna struggled to sell, despite all her efforts to make a huge comeback. Point is that Madonna is not a stronger nor a more stable album seller than Celine, she just tries more. Therefore, I don't get why you act like it's completely irrational that people expect Celine to outsell her. It is true that Madonna sold slightly more the past 5 years, but again, Celine has been easily ahead of Madonna since her international debut. If you want to talk about facts, you should take into account that the release date is not the only factor that affects total sales.

 

Implying Celine's new album won't sell much cause her show faced a 4% decline the last month of its run makes no sense. She can sell her albums with 0 single success and 0 airplay and you think a 4% decline is an indicator of poor upcoming album sales?

[GoldenLeaf]

It is cool that you don't care about my opinion. Not nice, but cool. However, could you please really read what I'm saying before you post an answer?

 

I never said MDNA was a Flop, my comment was about the Fact that Madonna struggled to sell, despite all her efforts to make a huge comeback. Point is that Madonna is not a stronger nor a more stable album seller than Celine, she just tries more. Therefore, I don't get why you act like it's completely irrational that people expect Celine to outsell her. It is true that Madonna sold slightly more the past 5 years, but again, Celine has been easily ahead of Madonna since her international debut. If you want to talk about facts, you should take into account that the release date is not the only factor that affects total sales.

 

Implying Celine's new album won't sell much cause her show faced a 4% decline the last month of its run makes no sense. She can sell her albums with 0 single success and 0 airplay and you think a 4% decline is an indicator of poor upcoming album sales?

Madonna did indeed sold slightly more albums than Celine during the past 5 years but that's only because she released two comeback albums (Hard Candy in 2008 and MDNA in 2012) whereas Celine only released one comeback album (Taking Chances in 2007). Taking Chances and Hard Candy sold pretty much the same amount of albums anyway (both albums sold around 3.5 millions copies).

Edited December 11, 2012 at 12:47 AM by Calypso

[Xpresso]

I think it's much more difficult to release an album in 4th Quarter (October to December) than in April.

Sure, you get more sales are Christmas but competition is much harder since most big acts release around November. So you sell more for a month or so but you disappear from the charts much quicker too... AND it's MUCH MORE difficult to get a #1 album at that time of year.

 

Madonna disappeared from the charts really quickly after her April release... Yes, less sales at that time of year, but also a lot less competition. Imagine how quickly she would have fell off the charts if she had released MDNA in November...

[mike_z]

TAKING CHANCES was one of the best Celine Eras!!! I mean, since FALLING INTO YOU she hadn't been that cool!

It should have been a massive success... she was glowing, great sound, great songs, great spirit!

[Javito]

Good, you're a good fan. I like that.

 

But I personally want her to be successful, I don't want her to be perceived as a relic - she was scorned for the better part of a decade for not being able to score a hit single in Anglophone markets [the fact she can't score a hit single anymore in English markets doesn't bother me - the scorn did], and I would constantly have to draw upon her previous hits on other websites, in order to instigate some discussion about Celine. But since 2007, people seem to be a lot more into her - casual people.

 

And I want that to blow up in the next era - and she will only do that by selling more albums.

 

But hey, of course I would LOVE to see her next english album being as successful as Sans Attendre, selling millions and the press everywhere acclaiming the album. I'm not different than any other fan with this, every of us want to see our idol reaching the top again and selling more than anyone else, don't we? But since both Céline and René have made clear many times that this is not their goal anymore, we just can't grasp on something that its probably it won't happen anymore.

 

Céline had her time with big sales, and its been a long time since she (they) dediced to take another path with her career and the way she followed with the albums she releases-it's not that of commercial success. Would I love, as a fan, to be this different? Of course I'd love it! But since I've been waiting for her to do more "trending" music since ages and she has been constantly staying in her comfort zone, doing covers, slow ballads, and random songs which had 0.1% possibilities to be played on radios and sell in singles, i just gave up.

 

Yes, I finally resigned myself to see Céline again being played in radios or having videoclips in TV because she had another #1 song or a #1 album. Seeing what we've going to receive in "Water and a Flame", with songs like "Overjoyed", "At Seventeen", "Lullaby" or "Climb Every Mountain" doesn't exactly make me feel excited to even sight the slightest possibility of these songs making a CD which is supposed to be her BIG comeback album in 6 years a #1 album with smash sales

 

But that said, is that handful of old songs going to prevent me from enjoying the rest of the new songs in the album, which maybe are great and current with times? Of course NOT. I don't know where they will find the coherence in this album between these old random covers and the new songs, but after so many years of disappointment with her english career and her english concerts, I just gave up, and I prefer to enjoy each song, one at a time, as it goes. But I won't think anymore "this song doesn't fit in this album, or the tracklists is wrongly constructed", because the last album which had some coherence in its entirety was ANDHC (to me). Since then, all of her english albums have been a great mess, with no direction.

 

I know all what I'm saying here has little importance and has little to do in an era where people mostly consume songs by purchasing/downloading just the song they like to their PC/iPod, and not the full album, but I for one would like to stick up for the artistry of doing a full album, that has some coherence and cohesion in it, and where you can listen through it feeling that all the songs are linked one to each other. That should be a good album, no matter how the songs would sound.

 

So about sales... I just expect this album to sound good and the songs to have some sense in the album. I would love the album to have some base sound, I would love it to be uptempo or dance for a change, but since Céline or René are so obsessed with covering classics and recording slow songs, I can only hope these songs are at least good ones I just gave up hoping a return with radio-friendly tunes, because it just won't happen with Céline, there's no point in hoping that with her and her english albums

[DionFanAlways]

Yes, I finally resigned myself to see Céline again being played in radios or having videoclips in TV because she had another #1 song or a #1 album. Seeing what we've going to receive in "Water and a Flame", with songs like "Overjoyed", "At Seventeen", "Lullaby" or "Climb Every Mountain" doesn't exactly make me feel excited to even sight the slightest possibility of these songs making a CD which is supposed to be her BIG comeback album in 6 years a #1 album with smash sales

Javito you took the words/feelings right out of my mouth...I agree with your entire essay and I just want to highlight your statement about a big comeback.

[celinefanonline]

But that said, is that handful of old songs going to prevent me from enjoying the rest of the new songs in the album, which maybe are great and current with times? Of course NOT. I don't know where they will find the coherence in this album between these old random covers and the new songs, but after so many years of disappointment with her english career and her english concerts, I just gave up, and I prefer to enjoy each song, one at a time, as it goes. But I won't think anymore "this song doesn't fit in this album, or the tracklists is wrongly constructed", because the last album which had some coherence in its entirety was ANDHC (to me). Since then, all of her english albums have been a great mess, with no direction.

 

So about sales... I just expect this album to sound good and the songs to have some sense in the album. I would love the album to have some base sound, I would love it to be uptempo or dance for a change, but since Céline or René are so obsessed with covering classics and recording slow songs, I can only hope these songs are at least good ones I just gave up hoping a return with radio-friendly tunes, because it just won't happen with Céline, there's no point in hoping that with her and her english albums

 

well Miracle has direction!! lol just not for everyone lol

and that's kinda negative saying gave up hope though... it's still possible! but of course i understand what u mean!

and this album should sell some as Celine's album artists not really single artist so yeah!

[Javito]

I don't know who the hell at Sony got used to the idea that Celine Dion is an albums artist and not a single's artist If she's not been a single's artist its because Sony and her team worked hard for her not to be one. Period!

 

However, if her albums sold what they sold in the beggining (Unison, Celine Dion, TCOML and FIY) it was for the singles they promoted. But in the last decade, if she hasn't sold more singles (and therefore, been called a "single's artist") its only because Sony and her team worked very hard picking the wrong singles and not promoting the right ones in radios and TV But what concerns the content of her albums? They've had enough single material to swim in them and send several singles per album to radios and make great videos with them. They just didn't pay attention to these material. End of story!

[Xpresso]

Bingo, Javito!!!

That's how I see it too... it seems someone doesn't want her to have big singles...

Edited December 11, 2012 at 11:13 AM by Xpresso

[Moleque20]

Mylene's new album kicked a***ses this week! 145.000 copies! So, what Celine's position this week in the french charts?

[Fanxiaoqiang]

Mylene's new album kicked a***ses this week! 145.000 copies! So, what Celine's position this week in the french charts?

Mylene is so trong in France,and her first single atop the single chart and became Mylene's 13th NO.1 single in France!