This is getting serious :(

[fan2celinedion]

8 singles for UP

[Javito]

8 singles for UP

 

What an album she did, didn't she? 2002 was a great year musically, with Céline's A New Day Has Come and Shania's Up!, it was heaven. Both so fresh, young, powerful and in a high spirits mood :in_love:

[Davey84]

7 singles for Incognito out of the 8 songs

 

those were the days

[Shaun]

There is a reason there were 8 singles from "Up" and only 3 from "Taking Chances" for example. Radio stations want to play music that the masses are interested in hearing.

 

Sadly both "Taking Chances" and "Alone" were none of those and in due course didn't get played anywhere. "Eyes On Me" was a step in the right direction but it didn't get worldwide Sony support and no video so was destined to fail. I just look at Celine's appearance on The X Factor in the UK as a prime example of the lack of direction Sony have for Celine. Every single special guest who appears on The X Factor gets a boost in their sales from that one performance. More often than not it results in a number 1 single or certainly a top 10 charting. Celine managed to get to number 40 in the UK after her performance on that show which I think just says everything about the choice of that song as a single.

 

The truth is there is no one person to blame here. Until the whole Celine "machine" starts working in unison again like it did in the 90's Celine will continue to struggle to get her singles heard by the masses.

[Jessyka]

Just tell me which record label would be better for her? I doubt anyone can get a better contract for her than Rene. I just wonder what makes you think you or anyone of us can do a better job than Rene and her manage team.

 

Couldn't agree more.

[Javito]

7 singles for Incognito out of the 8 songs

 

those were the days

 

Yeah, and it only had 8 songs then! Imagine today 16 singles out of 17 songs in ANDHC

 

In Spain there was a group that released a special boxset from their latest album that was sold with the message "make your own singles choice adventure", and included dozens of pictures with the photographs of the album photoshoot (which was fantastic) and you could make covers for each single. Even if you didn't like the printed covers included, you could use a special PC software to combinate the pictures you wanted and write the single track you wanted on it It was a special edition made for and thinking about the fans of course, but because they knew that all the songs could be singles and the photoshoot of the album was great.

 

I've dreamed many times of this with Céline's ANDHC... (yes I'm obsessed )

[fan2celinedion]

Sabes como se llama este grupo? Me gusta mucho esta idea!

Oh! Spanish mode-------->english mode

Sorry ^^'

[Celinefanatic07]

Truthfully, I believe Celine is exactly where she wants to be. Celine is not trying to recruit new fans. How many other artists can sells albums without promotion? Yes, album sales are "only" in the low millions but how many artists would give their right arm for sales like that? If Rene hated Sony's antics Celine would be outta there. Nothing will change because this is what Celine wants!

 

 

 

AGREED! end of story

[OlivierAllemagne]

Maybe I will sound rude and I am sorry in advance I don't mean it personnaly to you guys, I know you are good guys and want the best for Céline, and I d even say I was like you... 10 years ago (wanting always more more more).

 

but I see frustration and pretentiousness in this topic...

 

Frustration of fans who think Céline Dion's "success" performance is not enough, who always want more, who think Celine Dion - the adult conteporary artist - can be "cool" and have dance or RnB songs played on the same radios like Madonna, Gaga or Beyonce. Guys this is not Céline's style and this is not fashionable at the moment (maybe it will become back mainstream who knows?), I don't think Sony can do a lot against that trend.

 

Pretentiousness from those who say like "anyway Sony people can't do their job, their teams are nothing good, etc"... PLEASE guys, who ARE you to be so affirmative ? Are you in business, strategy, show-business ??

 

Do you really think Céline Can be in the top spotlight every month of the year with a new single hitting all radios ? Please come back on earth, overexposure is totally inefficient. Let the new artists be overexposured. Celine is a legend, she'll go her way, some singles will work, some not. Look at other legends, we never hear so much of them on mainstream radios (Ok Madonna had a few hits in the years 2000, but she's in the "Pop-dance" style).

 

Was the TC promo not enough for you ? the AND show promo unsuccessfull ? the ANHC promo not enough ? The d'Elles promo had 2 specials (quebec and Canada) and a number 1 in France still does mean something. Sorry but i am unaware who is number 1 at the moment in France. So it has nothing to do with sony if ESINRQ is not known by everybody in France. That's just normal ! I don't understand !! For each release there IS promo, there IS TV, there IS special edition !!

 

I personnally think we had enough special editions of ANDHC (CD, CD/DVD, Collector's edit), TC (CD, CD/DVD, CD/DVD/perfume/package), MIRACLE (book, box, CD), d'Elles (at least 3 editions), 1 fille 4 types (same)...

 

Something else: the success of artists shows through stage performances (more than through radio and albums sales) : Céline is one of the VERY top artists of the last decade thanks to vegas (4200 seats each night) and TC world tour (2nd most successful tour ever for a solo artist).

Edited June 7, 2010 at 08:54 AM by OlivierAllemagne

[OlivierAllemagne]

Come on, her breakthrough is greatly due to a combination of Céline, her team and Sony's efforts in 1990's, Céline herself always says she trusts her team enormously.

 

And no, it's not thanks to her team, it's thanks to her but I'm sure she would have left them a long time ago if she really wanted.

[OlivierAllemagne]

:doh:

 

Oh yes, Céline is totally naive... I think she knows less in showbusiness than you do

 

I know Celine says she's not involved in business and figures, but still, please guys, you can criticize Sony as much as you want, but be REASONABLE in what you say Or it becomes nonsense !!

 

"how they act in reality" = OMG is there a PLOT against Celine ?

 

Do you think Celine thought about that, at least once? it's not that she wants it, it's that she doesn't know and is not interested on those kind of stuff! She trusts her team but she doesn't know how they act in reality!

[OlivierAllemagne]

But all what you mention involves AN ENORMOUS deal of MONEY INVESTMENT and OF ARTIST INVOLVEMENT

 

How can you be so SURE about yourself ??? As if everything was so EASY and OBVIOUS... I mean

 

Sorry guy, the Sony conspiracy Theory does not work with me...

 

A music company is not here to rule the artist's career, it's mainly here to distribute CD's. The carreer is managed more directly by Céline herself (what she wants to do, to not do as an artist) and her management team, i.e. René, feeling and Sony marketing team. I mean this is not Sony that does everything with the artist staying at home waiting for her singles to be bombarded.

 

 

A team that bombards radios with her new singles just as they bombard us with Beyoncé, Shakira, Madonna and all those ones.

A team who cares wether to release a videoclip to support a new single or not.

A team who cares about releasing a third, fourth or even fifth single if an album deserves it because it has great songs (and we've been through many albums already thrown to the bin, since ANDHC in 2002).

 

Etc etc etc.

 

Because the question is, would Céline raise any objection to her music being played more in radios today?

 

Would Céline raise any objection if she had more than 2 singles from an english album (what they did with A New Day Has Come and Taking Chances albums is bashful)

 

Would Céline raise any objection if her team cared to remix her songs and make dance versions for them to be played on radios, discos etc, like Beyoncé's and Madonna's songs are?

 

Would Céline raise any objection if her team asked her to shoot another videoclip to support her second/third single?

 

I don't think so! Like you see, its absurd

Edited June 7, 2010 at 09:55 AM by OlivierAllemagne

[Javito]

"how they act in reality" = OMG is there a PLOT against Celine ?

 

Do you think Celine thought about that, at least once? it's not that she wants it, it's that she doesn't know and is not interested on those kind of stuff! She trusts her team but she doesn't know how they act in reality!

 

Within the radio stations that refuse to play her? Of course there is Open your eyes (ears), she's not played anywhere. Some members here even know that radio dj's see a new single from her and they don't even care to listen it!

 

In her own entourage and her team? I don't think so, but they just don't have a clue of what to do today. They act blindness. No one in his right mind would have occurred to release "My Love" to promote a greatest hits and cut the promotion of a great album like Taking Chances, instead of continuing the promotion of that album through 2008 and 2009 during her tour

[Javito]

But all what you mention involves AN ENORMOUS deal of MONEY INVESTMENT and OF ARTIST INVOLVEMENT

 

How can you be so SURE about yourself ??? As if everything was so EASY and OBVIOUS... I mean

 

Sorry guy, the Sony conspiracy Theory does not work with me...

 

A music company is not here to rule the artist's career, it's mainly here to distribute CD's. The carreer is managed more directly by Céline herself (what she wants to do, to not do as an artist) and her management team, i.e. René, feeling and Sony marketing team. I mean this is not Sony that does everything with the artist staying at home waiting for her singles to be bombarded.

 

So? You are saying that I'm right then! If Sony isn't there to control her album promotion, the singles they have to release and all that, but neither Céline herself, then she should have a good TEAM behind her who should care about all that!

 

According to you, it is ok that Sony doesn't give a damn about Céline's career, it is ok that neither Céline nor René care about these aspects either, then what we do? We release an album so that we don't care about it anymore and be forgotten after the first week of its release? Is that the best thing for you? Do you really want Céline's music to be like that in the future?

 

EDIT:

 

What I said you're right, it involves a lot of money (something that shouldn't be a problem for Sony and an artist like Céline!), but artist involvement?? By no means! Pardon moi, but sending and releasing singles to the radio and making some remixes of a song doesn't require Céline personally to do it. It just involves picking one picture of the album photoshoot, the single song and send it to the radio or the CD manufacturers in Austria to produce the single Every record label does that thing thousands of times each day

 

I repeat to make that clear: releasing a second, third, even fifth single from her Taking Chances album (for example) doesn't require any action from Céline. Its her lazy gang of team behind her who has to do that BUT THEY JUST DON'T

 

Regarding a videoclip, shall I remind you that she can shot a videoclip in one evening, like she did with One Heart? She can shot 5 videoclips in 1 or 2 weeks and the world won't end for her for doing that. And with all this done, the album promotion can follow its course only if they wanted, without Céline doing nothing, but providing she had a team behind her doing that WORK

Edited June 7, 2010 at 10:13 AM by Javito

[OlivierAllemagne]

No im not saying you re right Javito, I think you and Fan2 are totally unaware of Marketing techniques, media and business... I don't know much about music business, but still I know what it is like to sell new products, to communicate and to launch concepts, to make business forecasts as well (I worked in Distribution-Marketing for a big German car Manufacturer and for a luxury French jewellery brand (Céline is a customer of lol))

 

Thank God there are forum members with whom I totally agree and who - to me - seem to be down to earth: Bellamy and Samart.

 

I can't believe how sure you are of yourself (saying Celine and her entourage are blind, etc...)

 

Radios not playing Céline is a question of trend and radio style and proves Sony has nothing to do with that. Go to AC radio stations !

Edited June 7, 2010 at 10:27 AM by OlivierAllemagne

[Javito]

If not agreeing in how they are treating Céline's albums today and giving opinions of what we think it should be done is to be not down to earth for you, then there are dozens of nuts here

 

And if you only come here to read comments of people when they only agree with you, well I'm sad for you. You still don't know what's the purpose of a discussion forum and can't make the most of it

[celinefanonline]

oh well too bad that in UK they don't have top of the pops anymore ...

[Javito]

Radios not playing Céline is a question of trend and radio style and proves Sony has nothing to do with that. Go to AC radio stations !

 

Radios not playing Céline is a question that they sent the worst choice for single to be played on radios over and over again . Go back to 2002, when she released ANDHC remix, and then I'm Alive. It greatly worked. Then GTSW and the mess is back again, radios confused and public too. Then IDAN and it was successful too.

 

If they want to try new things, they have to insist on them to convince people. Wasn't it about "taking chances" in 2007? I agree its not easy. But they can't release one great uptempo/dance song like IDAN or ANDHC, and then come with a ballad whose topic is about a girl crying her mother will die or a ballad like My Love. Leave those songs within the album, and release the proper singles for radios. People want to cheer up when listening to radio, not to hear sad or boring songs. And Céline has recorded those uptempo, positive, dance songs, she has those songs, but they just sent the worst choices to radios. Its just about that

[OlivierAllemagne]

??? Please don't be sad for me. I like to read comments of people with whom I don't agree and that's why I even like to answer and give my own opinion. I don't see your point.

 

Celine still sells well/very well (TC ) 3,2 millions = Good to Very Good and there WAS promotion.

 

Celine is the number one artist of the decade in the US according to the LA Time

 

Celine just finished the 2nd most successful tour ever by a solo artist

 

Celine's latest DVD do not need much promotion as you should not over expose an artist. Promotion will be needed for next albums and New Las Vegas show, not for DVD's of 2 years ago tour (same for Madonna's DVD of her last tour).

 

In conclusion there is no problem to me. If you want to be fan of a cool mainstream artist who is 25 years old, then become a fan of Gaga (I saw her in concert it's really nice, I m going back in October, but I ll remain an uncool Celine Dion fan, and proud to be so).

[fan2celinedion]

Thank you very much Javito!

How many time have I been surprised because some of my friends told me they liked one of her song on my iPod! Yesterday, someone even send me a message to tell me he discovered a Celine song he really liked it!

Sorry, you can listen to Lady gaga, Rihanna etc...and listen to Celine Dion too!

Edited June 7, 2010 at 11:02 AM by fan2celinedion

[fan2celinedion]

I think you and Fan2

Sorry but we are not the only one to think so!

And it's sad to see that for you, someone who is down to earth is someone who think the same thing as you!

[Davey84]

we are not saying Céline isn't succesful anymore, of course TC sold 'ok' and her tour and AND were huge succeses... but that doesn't change the fact that sony only cares for the first 2 months of a new album. 2 examples:

 

1 they decide on forehand that TC, Alone and EOM are singles. in that order and nothing else. they are surprised the fans totally LOVE Fade Away, but they don't do anything about it! No promotion with (or for) that song whatsoever! we were lucky to have it on tour!

 

2 D'elles was a mess too! after a no 1 ESNRQ they release Immensité to the radio, weeks later the video finally is released, but instead of a single it's burried on the TC single! A cause was kinda released, even with a remix, no video whatsoever.... but no they choose to promo Alone instead, which resulted in a flopping 'Alone' single and a even more flopping A cause! (which IMO could have been a big hit in France!)

 

it's frustrating that good songs are not promoted well.. it's not only about album sales, but it's also about giving songs the opportunity to be known to the world, and a chance for céline to loose her MHWGO image!

 

and I might not be down to earth then, I'd take that any day over just accepting the fact that Sony (and her team and Céline herself) are wasting her career

[fan2celinedion]

Davey? You are here? I thought me and Javito were the only people who were not "down to earth"?... Edited June 7, 2010 at 11:35 AM by fan2celinedion

[OlivierAllemagne]

Javito I read all what you wrote in this topic and couldn't disagree more with you (even more that with Fan2, with whom I always disagree in the French section ).

 

But as you said this is the purpose of a forum to read different opinions.

 

On Sony and Celine = I feel you misinterpret and overinterpret things way too much = Sony already knew of Céline's plans for Vegas before ANHC and still decided to promoto ANHC. ANHC DID conquer the world (number 1 in many countries, 12 millions, one of best selling albums in 2002).

 

What you call "a strange carreer move" was labelled as the "most intelligent decision in show business in years" by music insiders (in a context where music sales declined stongly).

 

Sorry if you think a music company can release successful singles without artist's involvement I think you are totally, but totally wrong !!! It demands much artist's involvment. And I think Celine is involved in an other way: she's a singer and has been on stage SINGING most of the 2000's.

 

Up may have had 8 singles, but what did Shania become after that album ??

 

I LOVE GTSW, it s a SUPERB song, it's Celine-like. Same for My Love. These are excellent choices, this ressembles Céline, this is HER style. I like her uptempo songs as well, but not only. My Love is a dear song to Celine.

 

You said Celine and René and team are not aware of today's trends and strategies, I think it's not true, they are extremely aware and intelligent.

 

I personnally love Celine Dion the classic legend, singing love songs and talking about her family. If Celine one day wants to be very edgy/trendy/young/ even Rnb then it's very good (I love Madonna and Mariah Carey and Gaga), but I doubt she will make that choice. She will be more Barbra-like. Maybe more rock or even jazzy. But mainstream pop/RnB, no way she makes that choice and even if she did, i doubt it could work.

[Davey84]

I'm on cloud number 9

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4c/Oncp1.jpeg

 

 

edgy/trendy/young/= FADE AWAY

 

 

today's music is not only r'n b you know! I don't want Céline to record that and have ft rappers all the time! but a song like When Love Takes Over could have easily been recorded by Céline! She aint 84 yet you know! Plus I'd love it if Céline goes more to the pop/rock side again! which is her base too! Incognito/Unision/Falling Into You, she's not only a ballad singer, as she said herself

 

and Goodbye is a nice song and her style, but HYEBIL or TGR were better ballad choices...

Edited June 7, 2010 at 11:43 AM by Davey84

[fan2celinedion]

I'm on cloud number 9

 

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/4c/Oncp1.jpeg

 

...and?

[OlivierAllemagne]

Come on Fan2, don't make lessons of morale to me ok ? Don't insist on these little things to create more drama !!

 

"Down to earth" was just an expression, don't act as if you felt so injured by this expression.

 

"it's sad to see that for you..." please stop that Fan2.

 

I think you and Fan2

Sorry but we are not the only one to think so!

And it's sad to see that for you, someone who is down to earth is someone who think the same thing as you!

[fan2celinedion]

edgy/trendy/young/= FADE AWAY

 

 

today's music is not only r'n b you know! I don't want Céline to record that and have ft rappers all the time! but a song like When Love Takes Over could have easily been recorded by Céline! She aint 84 yet you know! Plus I'd love it if Céline goes more to the pop/rock side again! which is her base too! Incognito/Unision/Falling Into You, she's not only a ballad singer, as she said herself

ABSOLUTELY!

Edited June 7, 2010 at 11:43 AM by fan2celinedion

[SlovakClark]

I remember year 2002, she was at the same line like Madonna, even better i think,

then vegas come and it changed everything.

You cant expect people in business will love an artist who hack in city of hazard for 5 years and now even more, plus a singer which whole work for album means one or two weeks in music studio talks about everything...

She had and still have great potential, I remember after Prague concert, in newspapers and internet wrote: "Madonna, Kylie, envy! Celine Dion has reached for the stars!" or "I can not recover from the incredible experience"

for certain she should be more famous than Madonna, but compare the teams behind both of them and you have an answer. And finally: thats her decision, if she doesnt care, why we?

BUT its frustrating to know where in the industry she should be...

[OlivierAllemagne]

Totally agree with the pop/rock side and album examples !!! But all these songs still sound really AC, if you compare to today's radio hits.

 

today's music is not only r'n b you know! I don't want Céline to record that and have ft rappers all the time! but a song like When Love Takes Over could have easily been recorded by Céline! She aint 84 yet you know! Plus I'd love it if Céline goes more to the pop/rock side again! which is her base too! Incognito/Unision/Falling Into You, she's not only a ballad singer, as she said herself

 

and Goodbye is a nice song and her style, but HYEBIL or TGR were better ballad choices...

Edited June 7, 2010 at 11:55 AM by OlivierAllemagne