879 replies to this topic

[rfkavanagh]

I’m surprised to see people are so surprised at the idea that elements such as her hair were researched. When money’s at stake, *everything* is researched! Both qualitatively (focus groups, dyads, open-ended questions, etc.) and quantitatively (forced choice questionnaires, online surveys, mass polling, etc.). Decisions are rarely made on a whim or due to one person’s preference - there’s too much at stake (sales, jobs, branding, reputation, bookings…).

TC/Sony were conducting online fan research as far back as before the release of LTAL - they shared the album songs ahead of release to garner comments, gauge popularity of individual tracks, identify potential singles, etc. And that was just the first research cycle I personally knew of - I’m sure Sony was doing it well before then, too.

*Every* decision is a business decision. You may disagree with the result - as we all do on occasion - but at Céline’s level, decisions are rarely made lightly or without some level of consumer validation.

That’s not to say that Céline can’t just decide one day “screw that, I’m cutting and bleaching my hair,” but there are whole teams of people to then post-validate and “encourage” change based on the results!

[Celinelife]

Was something similar happened to Lying Down? But well it was never shown to us or anyone except TC or Sony so how would they know if we love it or not?

[rfkavanagh]

The Lying Down video may never have reached that point - I’d imagine if it ever got as far as being shown to consumers, word would have gotten out. It was most likely canceled much earlier in the decision flow.

[Celinelife]

Somebody asked Kaven, Celine's guitarist on his latest post about Lying Down music video. He said "I have no idea!"

[Xpresso]

Celinelife, on 23 July 2021 - 09:05 PM, said:

Somebody asked Kaven, Celine's guitarist on his latest post about Lying Down music video. He said "I have no idea!"

Fans should stop harassing Celine's musicians about music videos. They wouldn't know about that.

[CelinesDIVO5]

Xpresso, on 24 July 2021 - 05:07 PM, said:

Fans should stop harassing Celine's musicians about music videos. They wouldn't know about that.

This.

[idroveallnight]

My guess is they use YouTube analytics to determine if it will be a worthwhile investment to spend boatloads of money to create a new video. Celine's older videos way outperform her new material. It's been almost 2 years and Imperfections and Courage have less than 10M views. The audio version of Lying Down is doing better than both... so I'm sure they were like why are we spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on this when no one is watching it? Sad but that's the reality.

[ryba]

idroveallnight, on 27 July 2021 - 11:19 AM, said:

My guess is they use YouTube analytics to determine if it will be a worthwhile investment to spend boatloads of money to create a new video. Celine's older videos way outperform her new material. It's been almost 2 years and Imperfections and Courage have less than 10M views. The audio version of Lying Down is doing better than both... so I'm sure they were like why are we spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on this when no one is watching it? Sad but that's the reality.

they could only put the videos on YouTube and delete the audios for courage and LD

[CelinesDIVO5]

idroveallnight, on 27 July 2021 - 11:19 AM, said:

My guess is they use YouTube analytics to determine if it will be a worthwhile investment to spend boatloads of money to create a new video. Celine's older videos way outperform her new material. It's been almost 2 years and Imperfections and Courage have less than 10M views. The audio version of Lying Down is doing better than both... so I'm sure they were like why are we spending hundreds of thousands of dollars on this when no one is watching it? Sad but that's the reality.

But the money has already been allotted and spent on concept, set and crew. So this doesn’t make sense either.

[Celinelife]

Well if they had spend money I don't see any reason of not releasing it. Why to waste the money and effort? Celine loved the concept from what we heard in the interview. And fans also loves the concept. I mean, who doesn't?

[rfkavanagh]

Celinelife, on 27 July 2021 - 09:20 PM, said:

Well if they had spend money I don't see any reason of not releasing it. Why to waste the money and effort? Celine loved the concept from what we heard in the interview. And fans also loves the concept. I mean, who doesn't?

The concept may have been great, but that doesn't mean the execution was.  Even with buy-in from all parties on concept, the best of intentions, preparation, and pre-production approvals of all elements, etc., sometimes productions just don't come together to everyone's satisfaction, whether on the day or in post (although heads often roll in those situations!).  None of us know if that's what happened to the Lying Down video, but it's certainly possible.  No amount of positivity on the shoot day - whether legit enthusiasm or just PR talking points - can prevail over a bad outcome.

[couldawouldashoulda]

Celinelife, on 27 July 2021 - 09:20 PM, said:

Well if they had spend money I don't see any reason of not releasing it. Why to waste the money and effort? Celine loved the concept from what we heard in the interview. And fans also loves the concept. I mean, who doesn't?

Think of it like all the tracks that were recorded but never released. Why spend the money on producing the track and put all the effort of Celine singing if it’s never released? Because that’s how the entertainment industry works. Sometimes you see or hear a finished product and all parties involve say, “Well, we tried that. We don’t think it worked. Let’s put that on the shelf.”

I understand that fans think “But…it happened. It exists! I have to see/hear it!!” It doesn’t always work out. Sometimes it does. It seems as if the fans who really wanted to hear the Spector tracks were able to buy them. Maybe someday, somehow, the Lying Down video will be something similar.

[idroveallnight]

CelinesDIVO5, on 27 July 2021 - 08:39 PM, said:

But the money has already been allotted and spent on concept, set and crew. So this doesn't make sense either.

Not for the actual deliverable though. I'm sure it was shot the same day as Courage and Imperfections so it wouldn't cost too much more for set up, lighting, cameras, etc. However, to edit all the footage down into an actual video costs boatloads of cash that I'm sure they don't want to dish out when the audio version is doing better than the other 2 videos.

[Dancing_Queen]

Still, if they were never gonna make or release the video, I would have expected them to use some shots/sequences for the tour. Or even a picture on social media. Can the video/look really be so godawful they can't recycle any of it for other uses?

[maki_Dion-er]

idroveallnight, on 28 July 2021 - 08:03 AM, said:

However, to edit all the footage down into an actual video costs boatloads of cash that I'm sure they don't want to dish out when the audio version is doing better than the other 2 videos.

I don't think it cost them as much as you may think.
Editing a 2-3 minute music video isn't nearly as costly as editing a feature film or news piece, plus pay varies on experience level.

Going by the views garnered just by the audio video I'm sure w/ the mv they would have made back what they spent on their editor.

I'm thinking they spent more on the director than the editor. Especially the one for Courage since he got a credit on the video, something never done for any of Celine's other mv. I wonder if the same person directed the LD video.

Edited by maki_Dion-er, 28 July 2021 - 01:57 PM.

[idroveallnight]

maki_Dion-er, on 28 July 2021 - 01:48 PM, said:

I don't think it cost them as much as you may think.
Editing a 2-3 minute music video isn't nearly as costly as editing a feature film or news piece, plus pay varies on experience level.

Going by the views garnered just by the audio video I'm sure w/ the mv they would have made back what they spent on their editor.

I'm thinking they spent more on the director than the editor. Especially the one for Courage since he got a credit on the video, something never done for any of Celine's other mv. I wonder if the same person directed the LD video.

Whatever the cost is -- which I'm sure it's an exorbitant one -- they didn't think it was worth the investment. That's all it comes down to. The album tanked in it's second week. We are lucky we at least got 2 new original videos.

[Nmj]

idroveallnight, on 28 July 2021 - 06:03 PM, said:

Whatever the cost is -- which I'm sure it's an exorbitant one -- they didn't think it was worth the investment. That's all it comes down to. The album tanked in it's second week. We are lucky we at least got 2 new original videos.

If you can call them that. Worst two videos in her career in my opinion. Worse than the fake water in the desert that was “Have You Ever Been In Love”, and whatever that weird doll stuff  that was apart of PQTME oh and let’s not forget the random giraffe that decided to cross the road in “Incredible”.

Fact of the matter is Celine’s music videos overall have always been lackluster to say the least… with the exception of some like IACBTMN, ANDHC, TC, and GBTSW.

[Celinelife]

I think Incredible was great. Yeah that giraffe is weird but symbolic.

[comingback]

Nmj, on 28 July 2021 - 08:44 PM, said:

If you can call them that. Worst two videos in her career in my opinion. Worse than the fake water in the desert that was "Have You Ever Been In Love", and whatever that weird doll stuff  that was apart of PQTME oh and let's not forget the random giraffe that decided to cross the road in "Incredible".

Fact of the matter is Celine's music videos overall have always been lackluster to say the least… with the exception of some like IACBTMN, ANDHC, TC, and GBTSW.

Are you kidding me? The PQTME video is a classic. The doll is a voodoo doll from an African tribe (because she sings: Les formules magiques des marabouts d' Afrique).

Edited by comingback, 29 July 2021 - 12:55 AM.

[joaofilho]

This Twitter profile is famous for getting the singers' news and releases right.
Who has Twiiter could ask about Celine what do you think??

https://twitter.com/abtlabinsider

Edited by joaofilho, 29 July 2021 - 05:48 AM.

[Celinelife]

I did let's see what will happen

[Celinelife]

Since we were talking about Music video one thing made me confused. Celine and René knew people didn't liked her short blonde hair then why they used it in HYEBIL and OH music video?

[Nmj]

Celinelife, on 29 July 2021 - 08:28 PM, said:

Since we were talking about Music video one thing made me confused. Celine and René knew people didn't liked her short blonde hair then why they used it in HYEBIL and OH music video?

What was she supposed to do? The music videos had to be recorded and she had the short blonde hair…it was too late. “et jetaime encore” also had the short blonde hair.

[Celinelife]

Why? She could have used a wig..

[rfkavanagh]

Her hair in those two videos had also been softened and they'd figured out how to style it far better than in the beginning - she actually looks pretty good in both of them, particularly One Heart.  The issue was never really with her having short hair (she'd already done that in '95-'96 with no problems).  It was that when she first got the cut, the shade of blonde was so wrong for her coloring, completely clashed with her fake tan, and the cut was horrendous!

[mirage]

Yup, the OH hair and HYEBIL hairdo were sooo good.
But at one point they choose to do it platinum yellow blonde and style it granny way.

The first pictures of her short hairdo in the AND show program were sooo good.

rfkavanagh, on 29 July 2021 - 10:47 PM, said:

Her hair in those two videos had also been softened and they'd figured out how to style it far better than in the beginning - she actually looks pretty good in both of them, particularly One Heart.  The issue was never really with her having short hair (she'd already done that in '95-'96 with no problems).  It was that when she first got the cut, the shade of blonde was so wrong for her coloring, completely clashed with her fake tan, and the cut was horrendous!

[ryba]

Celinelife, on 29 July 2021 - 08:28 PM, said:

Since we were talking about Music video one thing made me confused. Celine and René knew people didn't liked her short blonde hair then why they used it in HYEBIL and OH music video?

people hated it when they saw it during the AND show. These music videos were filmed before the show opened

[Celinelife]

Lying Down Official Audio has surpassed 10Million making it the second song in the Courage album hitting the 10 million mark on YouTube. So exciting.

[Bruno Portugal]

Celinelife, on 03 September 2021 - 02:58 AM, said:

Lying Down Official Audio has surpassed 10Million making it the second song in the Courage album hitting the 10 million mark on YouTube. So exciting.

10 Million views without a music video release... Now imagine with a music video and a single remix by David Guetta.

Edited by Bruno Portugal, 03 September 2021 - 01:58 PM.

[GoldenLeaf]

ryba, on 04 August 2021 - 09:30 AM, said:

people hated it when they saw it during the AND show. These music videos were filmed before the show opened

No, actually these music videos were filmed back-to-back on 29 and 30 April 2003, more than a month after the show opened.